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| Duck Pond Market for SALE ? https://www.paphospeople.com/ppforum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=32353 |
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| Author: | MALSUE [ Fri Mar 03, 2017 5:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
From Duck Pond Facebook Page:- Duck pond market Paphos cyprus 5 hrs · Very successful Paphos market And car boot FOR SALE For details contact us on 96586744 |
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| Author: | Topgun [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Quote: Very successful Paphos market And car boot FOR SALE I would suggest that the word 'once' would be appropriate at the start of this sentence. |
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| Author: | Fylde Filly [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 11:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
It's all Neil's fault for taking his bacon butties away! |
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| Author: | Wavy Dave [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 12:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
I suggest the wording is totally out of order. The Duckpond market is not for sale, as it includes stallholders, some of whom have been there for years. THEY are the Market. What is for sale is the running of the market, and collecting of rents, and to some extent the maintenance of the Market. A great pity that the "sale" has been misinterpreted. 
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Sorry WD this is from their Facebook page Very successful Paphos market And car boot FOR SALE https://www.facebook.com/DUCKPONDMARKETCY/ The stall holders and trader need to take it up with Don and Wendy to have it amended if it is false representation  In our opinion, and I stress this is our personal opinion, apart from the book exchange; the toiletries / cosmetic stall; the fruit & veg lady and the Syrian guy who sells casual clothing, the rest is just a big car boot sale. Since the new owners took over 4 years ago, there appears to be about half the number of stalls and on a couple of occasions (ok it was during the winter) the stallholders greatly outnumbered the customers. I think the removal of the ‘bandstand’ sounded the death knell since there is now no outside shade in the summer and there is no comparison with the burger van (when it’s open) and the previous ‘catering’ service.  A lot of money needs to be spent on it. |
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| Author: | zorbathejock [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Smokey Pete is a good asset at the Duckpond. Great fish. |
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
You are correct Zorba....sorry I missed out Pete  What I have trouble understanding is why someone would PAY €50 -€60 to run the market, collect rents and carry out maintenance of the Market. Surely someone should be getting PAID to do these jobs |
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| Author: | Wavy Dave [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 3:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
M.A.D wrote: You are correct Zorba....sorry I missed out Pete What I have trouble understanding is why someone would PAY €50 -€60 to run the market, collect rents and carry out maintenance of the Market. Surely someone should be getting PAID to do these jobs The Market Managers have to pay a person a certain amount, and even he is not the owner as he leases the land/property from another who actually owns the property and also wants paying. After that, presumably the rest of the money is theirs! The stall holders, especially the permanent one's who are there 104 times out of 104 times a year are dilligently trying to serve their regular customers as well as the occasional ones' and tourists. |
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| Author: | Josef K [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 4:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
What is the sale price I wonder? |
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 5:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Josef K wrote: What is the sale price I wonder? You could always phone them and ask them if interested
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| Author: | Neil [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Wavy Dave wrote: I suggest the wording is totally out of order. The Duckpond market is not for sale, as it includes stallholders, some of whom have been there for years. THEY are the Market. What is for sale is the running of the market, and collecting of rents, and to some extent the maintenance of the Market. A great pity that the "sale" has been misinterpreted. I think you will find that wendy will have something to say about that mate .. I have heard her on more than once , screaming at people who did not agree with the way the market was run.. "ITS MY Pity....ING MARKET AND I WILL RUN IT AS I LIKE .. Unfortunitly , thats been into the ground.. I really do feel for the stall holders , they have put years into there businesses, only to see them dwindle away due to bad managment I was one of them .. 
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| Author: | Wavy Dave [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 9:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Hopefully when enquiries are made to the current leaseholders, that the mistaken belief by some customers already that the whole entity is going, including the stallholders, will be explained that is not the case. |
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| Author: | Bassman63 [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 10:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
We will be very sad if it doesn't continue as it was always on our must visit list every time we were over especially Neil's Bacon Butties. |
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| Author: | MALSUE [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 10:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Bassman63 wrote: We will be very sad if it doesn't continue as it was always on our must visit list every time we were over especially Neil's Bacon Butties. Neil & Oxana moved out of Duckpond about 6 months ago, They have a cafe about 150 meters away (on the same road) towards Main Road from Paphos to Coral Bay. There was a post relating to reasons given at the time. |
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| Author: | George [ Sat Mar 04, 2017 10:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Post subject: Re: No bacon butties at the Duck Pond todayPostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:08 pm Online Master Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:19 pm Posts: 415 Location: Derbyshire Peak District Really Peed off when I first started to read this topic as the first thing we ever did at the Duckpond was to go for Neil's world famous Butties. We look forward to them when visiting Cyprus. So glad that he's set up just down the road, we wont be over till June but will defo be using the new location. |
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Sun Mar 05, 2017 7:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Wavy Dave wrote: Hopefully when enquiries are made to the current leaseholders, that the mistaken belief by some customers already that the whole entity is going, including the stallholders, will be explained that is not the case. It would certainly be good if they explained more to the stall holders and on their Facebook page. I know someone has asked on their page for a price and a different person asked exactly what they would be getting for their money but the second post has subsequently been deleted, and there has been no reply to the first post. Should be some interesting conversations when they collect ‘the rent’ from stall holders on Sunday It would be appreciated if you could come back to us if you learn anything....TQ |
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| Author: | George [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
So, how did Sunday go? Any clearer info forthcoming? |
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| Author: | Topgun [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 9:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Quote: Should be some interesting conversations when they collect ‘the rent’ from stall holders on Sunday Why would they bother to turn up? Suggest they would be better to spend their time finding another 'pitch' that would stand a chance of giving them a return, rather than this apology for a market. |
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| Author: | Neil [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 2:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Topgun wrote: Quote: Should be some interesting conversations when they collect ‘the rent’ from stall holders on Sunday Why would they bother to turn up? Suggest they would be better to spend their time finding another 'pitch' that would stand a chance of giving them a return, rather than this apology for a market. when they purchased the market 4 years ago for 7,000 euros it was a thriving market, now stall numbers have halved , wednesday market is almost non exsistant, stall takings have dropped 75% , yes ! people are only taking a quarter of what they use to take . Now get this ! ... What would you guess the asking price for the market is ?? I already know .. Free bacon roll and hot drink for the person that gets the nearest.. |
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| Author: | holitec [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 2:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Neil, I will take a wild guess. It should be "free to a good home", but I suspect that as the purchase was for 7k, income dropped to stallholders to 25%, I would assume that 28k would be the asking price! Digby |
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| Author: | Neil [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 3:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
holitec wrote: Neil, I will take a wild guess. It should be "free to a good home", but I suspect that as the purchase was for 7k, income dropped to stallholders to 25%, I would assume that 28k would be the asking price! Digby not even close .. 
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| Author: | Daz [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
higher ? 
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| Author: | George [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
What So I'm assuming it's even more than Digbys presumed "joke" price? Meaning they're assuming that they have more than quadrupled the value in the four years they have had it?? Which certainly doesn't seem to be borne out by your comments Neil. If so, previous comments are indeed right, who would have it? |
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| Author: | Wavy Dave [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Can I just remind members, that some comments may be more harming to current stallholders. Just a thought, but maybe worth considering. |
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| Author: | shania [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
My guess €3200.00 
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
If anyone wants to halve the bacon roll with me, i'll pm you the answer Only kidding and I will exempt myself from the competition
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| Author: | Josef K [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
George, the price wouldn't reflect the "value" of the market, as it doesn't have any significant assets. The building, for example, is on a annual rental basis as I understand it. The actual price for a business such as this should be based on a multiple of annual net earnings. It's not unusual for a multiple to be 3, so if we assume that to be the case, the price would be 3 times annual net earnings. So, to be hypothetical of course, if we say there are 100 tables at 10 euros a day for two days a week, we could round that down to annual earnings of, say, 100,000 euros a year. Deduct a rental of, say, 65,000 per annum and repairs/maintenance/advertising of 5000 euros per annum and that gives you actual net earnings of 30,000 euros. Given the multiple of 3, that would indicate a purchase price of around 90,000 euros. Of course this is purely hypothetical as I have no knowledge of the financials for this particular market, or indeed of any multiple used. Dave makes a valid point. Whatever people may think of the way the market is run, this is all outside the control of the stallholders. With the odd exception they are all good folks just trying to make a bob or two, and shouldn't come to harm because of actions of others. |
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| Author: | George [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 8:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Sorry to be pedantic JK, but the market does have a value, it's called goodwill. It's immeasurable and purely down to what the parties can reach an agreement on. This has come up in another thread. Goodwill has no measurable value, it's simply an asset which is traded and agreed between the parties. It has to be written off pdq, and can't remember the % as I said in the other thread, but no less than 20% P.A. This usually requires some justification. Any business is always worth only what a buyer is prepared to pay and for a 'business' with no assets it's only value is goodwill, and that is always presumptive and simply a base for discussion. It may well be the basis you have suggested. Whatever, the resultant 'value' must be written off, and therein lies the rub! For the sellers to suggest that the value of the business today is four times (or whatever the value is) the price they paid, and some of your suggestions may well be the calculations used used, I find it incredibly difficult, given Neil's comments, to justify placing an increased value on this sale. Whatever the formula you use. A massive increase such as MAY be suggested means that the purchasers have to write off a huge amount of goodwill in each trading year until it is at nil value. This will reduce their trading profits by a huge % . To withstand this, they will need to be taking in massive revenues in order to show a profit, for at least 5 years I would estimate. Given Neil's comments I don't see this as a likely business proposition. |
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| Author: | Neil [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 9:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Daz wrote: higher ? Watch the eyes ... 
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| Author: | Effsie [ Wed Mar 08, 2017 9:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Well, it is stated above that the building is rented and, if I understand right from the comments above, there are no particular assets, unl;ess the stallholders have copntracted to rent a table for a particular period of time (do stall holders do that?). I don't visit market stalls of that type but my guess is that those who do go visit to attend the individual stalls. That surely means that the stallholders could look to take over the building rental when the lease is up and just carry on and run the place between themselves. On that basis there surely isn't really any goodwill value, especially if the numbers of stalls and visitors are falling as was mentioned above. That should lave any potential value in the few hundreds. It would be very interesting to see how some of the figures mentioned could be justified. I don't know the market or any of the people involved, just curious about the figures. |
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| Author: | George [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 12:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
You're missing the point. This enterprise, or whatever you wish to call it was purchased 4 years ago, apparently for the capital sum of €7000. Exactly what was included in this sum is unknown, it nevertheless was a business purchase. The current owners are now looking to sell this business for an apparently upgraded sum. There is no option in this arrangement for the stall holders to take on the rent, or any other options. It is being sold as a going concern. There are no tangible assets, therefore on buying the business the buyer would have to immediately start writing off, or depreciating the difference between what he had paid for it and what any tangible assets of the business are actually worth. Call this what you will, but in accounting terms it is known as goodwill. Somewhere in his business books he has to account for this and depreciate it in the same way he would have to account for any tangible assets such as buildings, plant, vehicles etc etc. which he purchased under a normal business sale. This is a business, for which the current OWNERS apparently paid €7000. They are looking to sell this business for a hugely greater sum. And that sum will have to appear in the ongoing accounts of the purchaser. Given the absence of any tangible assets, it will appear as goodwill and will need to be written off speedily. Leaving the new owners with very little profit for several years to come. |
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| Author: | Big Nev [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 1:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
I have a friend who is a Saga Rep in one of the hotels along Poseidonos. They have been told to tell their guests not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed. |
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| Author: | Wavy Dave [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 1:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Big Nev wrote: I have a friend who is a Saga Rep in one of the hotels along Poseidonos. They have been told to tell their guests not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed. Big Nev, could you please tell your Saga Rep friend The Duckpond Market is not closed. This sort of misinformation is hurting the stallholders, many of whom have been there for some years, and have carried out their selling practices in a fair way, and are probably totally fed up with all the bad publicity that is going on at the moment. There is obviously some animosity between certain people, but that should be left to them to sort out privately I feel, and not be allowed to taint the regular custom that many stallholders have with their own customers. |
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| Author: | DollyDaydream1 [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 1:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Well said WD - these keyboard assassins are very dangerous! 
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| Author: | Wavy Dave [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 2:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
DollyDaydream1 wrote: Well said WD - these keyboard assassins are very dangerous! Thank you for your support and understanding BB. 
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 2:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Big Nev wrote: I have a friend who is a Saga Rep in one of the hotels along Poseidonos. They have been told to tell their guests not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed. I am sure that Wavy Dave and others, including myself, would be obliged if you would kindly contact your SAGA rep friend and ascertain exactly WHO instructed them to tell their clients that the market was closed |
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| Author: | Topgun [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 2:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Quote: Watch the eyes ... Ok Neil, I'll have a punt whilst others are working on their calculations. How about 5 times what they paid for it, 35,000 Euro's, or are they being even more greedy? |
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| Author: | Neil [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Topgun wrote: Quote: Watch the eyes ... Ok Neil, I'll have a punt whilst others are working on their calculations. How about 5 times what they paid for it, 35,000 Euro's, or are they being even more greedy? Try again .. |
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| Author: | Big Nev [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Wavy Dave wrote: Big Nev wrote: I have a friend who is a Saga Rep in one of the hotels along Poseidonos. They have been told to tell their guests not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed. Big Nev, could you please tell your Saga Rep friend The Duckpond Market is not closed. This sort of misinformation is hurting the stallholders, many of whom have been there for some years, and have carried out their selling practices in a fair way, and are probably totally fed up with all the bad publicity that is going on at the moment. There is obviously some animosity between certain people, but that should be left to them to sort out privately I feel, and not be allowed to taint the regular custom that many stallholders have with their own customers. Done. It probably came from someone local who said it was up for sale and thought the worst. |
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| Author: | George [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Awwwwwww, come on Neil, not 50k????? |
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| Author: | Neil [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 7:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
George wrote: Awwwwwww, come on Neil, not 50k????? According to my source , they have been offered that, but turned it down ..........  As thats not the asking price !! |
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| Author: | George [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 7:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Hells flippin bells
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| Author: | M.A.D [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 7:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Big Nev wrote: Wavy Dave wrote: Big Nev wrote: I have a friend who is a Saga Rep in one of the hotels along Poseidonos. They have been told to tell their guests not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed. Big Nev, could you please tell your Saga Rep friend The Duckpond Market is not closed. This sort of misinformation is hurting the stallholders, many of whom have been there for some years, and have carried out their selling practices in a fair way, and are probably totally fed up with all the bad publicity that is going on at the moment. There is obviously some animosity between certain people, but that should be left to them to sort out privately I feel, and not be allowed to taint the regular custom that many stallholders have with their own customers. Done. It probably came from someone local who said it was up for sale and thought the worst. So you are saying a SAGA rep, on the unsubstantiated information from ‘a local’ told the hotel SAGA clients not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed.
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| Author: | Big Nev [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 8:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
M.A.D wrote: So you are saying a SAGA rep, on the unsubstantiated information from ‘a local’ told the hotel SAGA clients not to take any trips to Duckpond, as it is closed. I don't know where the info came from. But the rep told me that it had closed. They take people on trips to various places around Pafos and Duckpond had been taken off the list, as has the indoor market in the old town. This latter due to the uneven pavements and unsure footing that is prevalent in the area at the moment. She is hardly going to go to check for herself if the Duckpond is open, just as she wouldn't turn up with 20 over 50's on the odd chance it was open, when she had been told it was closed. Unsubstantiated the info may be, but you are not going to take the chance when most of the guests are in their 70's and 80's. I have informed her that it is indeed open and she said it is now on the list for things to do in Paphos. |
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| Author: | ericturner [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
If a Certain person on this site is so interested in whats happening to the duckpond market, and how much its up for sale for, why doesn't he purchase it himself and give us all a rest. |
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| Author: | Sergio [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
ericturner wrote: If a Certain person on this site is so interested in whats happening to the duckpond market, and how much its up for sale for, why doesn't he purchase it himself and give us all a rest. well, in other thread I did ask same and got from SFD such reply: Quote: If you are "sick to see it", Sergio ..... don't read it !
There is a British saying ... "Put up or shut up". It's called freedom of speech, as we are not in a Dictatorship. |
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| Author: | Neil [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 10:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
ericturner wrote: If a Certain person on this site is so interested in whats happening to the duckpond market, and how much its up for sale for, why doesn't he purchase it himself and give us all a rest. It aint worth 50 quid , never mind 50k ... and who was asking for a rest ?? first time you spoke ? |
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| Author: | Navwoman [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 11:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
So €50K has been turned down. It is the stall holders that attract the customers and they're a cheerful bunch of people so can only guess that the rental of the place must be quite high. Well, I'll put my hat into the ring and suggest €72K. |
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| Author: | George [ Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Dead right Navwoman, the stallholders are the backbone of this organisation, yet they have no control whatsoever over what happens to their livelihoods, particularly regarding the rents they pay to the owner. And given the speculated sale values for which this organisation may be being offered, it means that the potential buyer will be shackled with years of goodwill which needs to be written off ASAP. No guesses as to who will be paying for this dead asset on the buyers books for many years to come. |
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| Author: | tanny [ Fri Mar 10, 2017 7:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Duck Pond Market for SALE ? |
Maybe the stallholders can for a committee to buy it and run it directly. |
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